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SloggingScotsman
Joined: 18 Jul 2006
Posts: 2967
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 Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:17 am Post subject: Vanity Fair and the Spy |
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“In these strange and troubling times, it is hard to speak unpalatable truths to power, but I believe we all still have a duty to do so”
Christopher Steel, former MI6 Officer, Sky News and Vanity Fair. (I always thought spooks kept you know hidden, but hey ho). From Apple News just now.
The man has a point.
Imagine for a moment you were a “power”. What would enable you to make the best decisions? Yes men brown nosing you, or people telling you the stuff you may not want to hear?
Sure as a “power” you can always chose to ignore such advice, but surely the responsible thing for a “power” to do is to consider all the facts before decision making?
If people really are scared to tell truth to power, then no wonder we are in the state we are in.
_________________
Trump elected.
We vote to Brexit..but something happens so it doesn’t.
Trump re-elected in 2020..99%
Something real bad happens to US during Trumps 2nd term..75%
Michelle Obama president in 2024...65%
In the next 10 years ww3 will start..47%.
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explorerJC
Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Posts: 16060
Location: Farthingstone
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Tigger
Joined: 25 Apr 2005
Posts: 2806
Location: Hampshire
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| Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:34 am Post subject: Re: Vanity Fair and the Spy |
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| SloggingScotsman wrote: | | it is hard to speak unpalatable truths to power |
It's true. Last time I did an FTP test, I just thought "feck, where's it all gone?" It was quite hard admitting that I hadn't been riding enough. But if you are brave enough do to a test, well its the truth, init. Still, once I had seen the numbers, I started riding more and things have been improving.
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SloggingScotsman
Joined: 18 Jul 2006
Posts: 2967
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| Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:36 am Post subject: |
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| explorerJC wrote: | | what unpalatable truths did he find it hard to speak of to power? |
who knows, you know what these spooks are like! That’s probably an official secret. Seriously though, the article I read did not say.
It did mention that it may have been alluding to Trump iirc. But my point is more general. If you were a “power” would you rather live in an echo chamber or be given the facts to make balanced decisions?
_________________
Trump elected.
We vote to Brexit..but something happens so it doesn’t.
Trump re-elected in 2020..99%
Something real bad happens to US during Trumps 2nd term..75%
Michelle Obama president in 2024...65%
In the next 10 years ww3 will start..47%.
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explorerJC
Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Posts: 16060
Location: Farthingstone
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| Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:50 am Post subject: |
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| SloggingScotsman wrote: | | explorerJC wrote: | | what unpalatable truths did he find it hard to speak of to power? |
who knows, you know what these spooks are like! That’s probably an official secret.
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sounds like padding then...
| SloggingScotsman wrote: | | you know what these spooks are like! |
i know of no one who uses that term...other than your good self, of course...
| SloggingScotsman wrote: |
It did mention that it may have been alluding to Trump iirc. But my point is more general. If you were a “power” would you rather live in an echo chamber or be given the facts to make balanced decisions? |
There is so much pandering to anti trump without value or consequence that the world is at risk of a second term...too many people think they are contributing to an effective opposition simply by virtue signalling...
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www.naturalrunningform.co.uk Natural Running Form Coach
2018 Training Camps http://www.appliedtri.co.uk/training-camps/
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jayski
Joined: 30 Jul 2018
Posts: 58
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| Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:00 pm Post subject: Re: Vanity Fair and the Spy |
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| SloggingScotsman wrote: | “In these strange and troubling times, it is hard to speak unpalatable truths to power, but I believe we all still have a duty to do so”
Christopher Steel, former MI6 Officer, Sky News and Vanity Fair. (I always thought spooks kept you know hidden, but hey ho). From Apple News just now.
The man has a point.
Imagine for a moment you were a “power”. What would enable you to make the best decisions? Yes men brown nosing you, or people telling you the stuff you may not want to hear?
Sure as a “power” you can always chose to ignore such advice, but surely the responsible thing for a “power” to do is to consider all the facts before decision making?
If people really are scared to tell truth to power, then no wonder we are in the state we are in. |
Sounds like a standard day at work. Evidently I am not a 'power'
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SloggingScotsman
Joined: 18 Jul 2006
Posts: 2967
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| Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:05 pm Post subject: |
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Ejc
You asked for this.
Trump has, in my opinion, a 99% chance of reelection. Regardless.
Why?
1. Loyal supporter base.
2. Tax cuts etc with associated feel good factor.
3. 2020 election will be before the economic hardship kicks in, and if that does happen before then, somehow his supporters will blame the Democrats.
4. His re-election is necessary for Michelle Obama to sweep to power in 2024. (Ok that is more a 💭 thought, if looking in cause and effect terms).
5. Geremandering.
6. Many people are fed up with what past “powers” have done to them, and he is is successfully tapping into that. Same energies globally, it’s why populists are currently popular. Past screw ups by the fabled “elite” as humanity evolved below them at a faster rate/or to keep in thread not listening adequately outside their echo chamber possibly. It’s what could result in the break up of the U.K. over the next few years, Sturgeon aside.
Accept it Ejc, Trump will almost definitely be re-elected President. I am sure you will remind me in a couple of years. (Remember I did predict his election. Nine months out, when even after the event the Economist wrote that it was unforseeable! Absolute tosh. Just because they could not foresee it, doesn’t mean others like me didn’t. Though to be fair few, if any, believed me at the time. Oxford University for anyone who may choose to verify.) And his daughter to become U.N. Ambassador! According to this mornings news.
_________________
Trump elected.
We vote to Brexit..but something happens so it doesn’t.
Trump re-elected in 2020..99%
Something real bad happens to US during Trumps 2nd term..75%
Michelle Obama president in 2024...65%
In the next 10 years ww3 will start..47%.
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explorerJC
Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Posts: 16060
Location: Farthingstone
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Jorgan
Joined: 12 Nov 2007
Posts: 18226
Location: alles was ich bin, alles was ich war
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| Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 2:07 pm Post subject: |
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Trump? What about Putin, Kim Jong Un, Assad.....
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27 Years since it all began....
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SloggingScotsman
Joined: 18 Jul 2006
Posts: 2967
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| Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 2:24 pm Post subject: |
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| Jorgan wrote: | | Trump? What about Putin, Kim Jong Un, Assad..... |
what about them?
_________________
Trump elected.
We vote to Brexit..but something happens so it doesn’t.
Trump re-elected in 2020..99%
Something real bad happens to US during Trumps 2nd term..75%
Michelle Obama president in 2024...65%
In the next 10 years ww3 will start..47%.
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Jorgan
Joined: 12 Nov 2007
Posts: 18226
Location: alles was ich bin, alles was ich war
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| Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 2:55 pm Post subject: |
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| SloggingScotsman wrote: | | Jorgan wrote: | | Trump? What about Putin, Kim Jong Un, Assad..... |
what about them? |
I'm suggesting they might be harder people to tell the truth to.
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27 Years since it all began....
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SloggingScotsman
Joined: 18 Jul 2006
Posts: 2967
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| Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 3:07 pm Post subject: |
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Jorgan
Probably.
But even so, assume for a moment you are Putin etc. Is it not in your best interest to be told the truth, to enable you not to miss anything? Your underlings might be scared senseless and afraid to annoy I give you, and could in some cases cost the underling his and his family’s life I give you, but ultimately you are only depriving yourself of valuable information, that could ultimately help you.
But such is the variety of life on this planet.
This is where I think Cameron went so wrong, his sofa close circle policymaking. Fortunately the hard data is now quietly being released by the government proving the errors of that way.
_________________
Trump elected.
We vote to Brexit..but something happens so it doesn’t.
Trump re-elected in 2020..99%
Something real bad happens to US during Trumps 2nd term..75%
Michelle Obama president in 2024...65%
In the next 10 years ww3 will start..47%.
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explorerJC
Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Posts: 16060
Location: Farthingstone
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| Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 3:42 pm Post subject: |
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| SloggingScotsman wrote: | Jorgan
Probably.
But even so, assume for a moment you are Putin etc. Is it not in your best interest to be told the truth, to enable you not to miss anything? Your underlings might be scared senseless and afraid to annoy I give you, and could in some cases cost the underling his and his family’s life I give you, but ultimately you are only depriving yourself of valuable information, that could ultimately help you.
But such is the variety of life on this planet.
This is where I think Cameron went so wrong, his sofa close circle policymaking. Fortunately the hard data is now quietly being released by the government proving the errors of that way. |
and the difference between Cameron and Blair was what exactly?
_________________
www.appliedtri.co.uk Tri and Du coaching
www.naturalrunningform.co.uk Natural Running Form Coach
2018 Training Camps http://www.appliedtri.co.uk/training-camps/
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SGreg
Joined: 30 Jun 2010
Posts: 1112
Location: High Peak
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| Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 3:53 pm Post subject: |
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| explorerJC wrote: |
and the difference between Cameron and Blair was what exactly? |
Chin fat...
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explorerJC
Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Posts: 16060
Location: Farthingstone
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