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Wheezy
Joined: 10 Oct 2007
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 Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 5:42 am Post subject: Swimming with a pullbuoy |
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As per the title. If I’m using a pull buoy is there anything I should be focussing on specifically in terms of body position/ roll, or is it just a way of giving your upper body more load to deal with?
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SidSnot
Joined: 02 Sep 2005
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| Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 8:02 am Post subject: Re: Swimming with a pullbuoy |
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| Wheezy wrote: | | As per the title. If I’m using a pull buoy is there anything I should be focussing on specifically in terms of body position/ roll, or is it just a way of giving your upper body more load to deal with? |
If you do use it, use it only for specific pull sets to isolate your legs and concentrate on working on a good catch(high elbow) at the front of your stroke. Perfecting the catch will help with sinky legs if you have them as you want to pull/push the water straight back rather than pushing down on the water
Too many triathletes become reliant on it IMHO
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Jorgan
Joined: 12 Nov 2007
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Location: alles was ich bin, alles was ich war
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| Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 8:15 am Post subject: |
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I normally use it when I'm swimming with paddles (drills or intervals). I'll also use it if my legs are fried from biking or running. Agree that you don't want to become too reliant on it though; easily done for sure!
I was chatting to a guy at the pool a while back that said he used his Huub Fatbuoy with a wetsuit in OW! How he manages in races I've no idea, but it's indicative of why people dread non-wetsuit races in OW.
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stenard
Joined: 04 Sep 2013
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| Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 8:53 am Post subject: |
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I've never seen too much benefit from a pull buoy. As Jorgan says, maybe with paddles or when doing drills like skulling, to enable focus on the front end.
One combo that really did identify some shakiness in my back end though was pull buoy and band. That was a bit of an eye opener. I intend to do a bit more of that over the winter.
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Jorgan
Joined: 12 Nov 2007
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Location: alles was ich bin, alles was ich war
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| Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 9:09 am Post subject: |
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| stenard wrote: | | One combo that really did identify some shakiness in my back end though was pull buoy and band. That was a bit of an eye opener. I intend to do a bit more of that over the winter. |
I always use a band on my ankles when doing Pull - an old inner tube knotted into a figure 8.
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PCP
Joined: 13 Oct 2012
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| Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 9:43 am Post subject: |
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| stenard wrote: | I've never seen too much benefit from a pull buoy. As Jorgan says, maybe with paddles or when doing drills like skulling, to enable focus on the front end.
One combo that really did identify some shakiness in my back end though was pull buoy and band. That was a bit of an eye opener. I intend to do a bit more of that over the winter. |
I've notice when using a PB and band that from the waist down I 'snake' a bit. Is this down to core strength or a stroke issue?
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stenard
Joined: 04 Sep 2013
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| Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 9:57 am Post subject: |
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| PCP wrote: | | stenard wrote: | I've never seen too much benefit from a pull buoy. As Jorgan says, maybe with paddles or when doing drills like skulling, to enable focus on the front end.
One combo that really did identify some shakiness in my back end though was pull buoy and band. That was a bit of an eye opener. I intend to do a bit more of that over the winter. |
I've notice when using a PB and band that from the waist down I 'snake' a bit. Is this down to core strength or a stroke issue? |
Not qualified to comment. But I get the same despite feeling fairly straight when I have the use of my legs. I intend to use it more just to highlight the result you mention, and hope that I naturally adapt my stroke over time to eliminate the snaking.
There is probably a better approach however! If it is a core strength issue, then maybe I don't actually want my stroke to adapt, and I just need to strengthen.
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hammerer
Joined: 19 Nov 2007
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| Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 10:13 am Post subject: |
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| PCP wrote: | | stenard wrote: | I've never seen too much benefit from a pull buoy. As Jorgan says, maybe with paddles or when doing drills like skulling, to enable focus on the front end.
One combo that really did identify some shakiness in my back end though was pull buoy and band. That was a bit of an eye opener. I intend to do a bit more of that over the winter. |
I've notice when using a PB and band that from the waist down I 'snake' a bit. Is this down to core strength or a stroke issue? |
either / or and a bit of both  suck your belly into your back, be 8 feet tall, somethign I say to the kids is think you are stealing cookies and reach for the cookie jar . maybe think stretching for the good whiskey instead  . Consider the direction of your pull / push. breathing can also throw off your legs. something i use to try and get people to think about head position and breathing is paddle on forehead. its fun so engaging but the pressure of the water should hold it against your forehead and then when breathing it should stay in place as you rotate the body and the head goes with it rather than wobbling the head about to breath!
bottom line thouigh the legs are being used to counter balance whatever issue you have so pull / bands highlights this. its all causing drag and wasted energy though. Best bet is to play about, count strokes and if they drop per length for same stroke rate you know you've done something right!
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stenard
Joined: 04 Sep 2013
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| Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 10:24 am Post subject: |
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Thanks Hammerer. Some fun suggestions there to mess around with in the off season!
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Jorgan
Joined: 12 Nov 2007
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| Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 10:41 am Post subject: |
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| PCP wrote: |
I've notice when using a PB and band that from the waist down I 'snake' a bit. Is this down to core strength or a stroke issue? |
Could be your body rotation; that can affect lots of things including catch, pull, breathing... your snaking from the hips.
A lot of people don't rotate from the hips, and that's the problem.
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Wheezy
Joined: 10 Oct 2007
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| Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:13 am Post subject: |
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Thanks everyone. Some great ideas to try out with some drill sets.
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gruffT
Joined: 23 Sep 2013
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| Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:35 am Post subject: |
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OK, I'll bite.
Regular 85% effort free = 1'55" /100
Similar effort Pull = 1'48" / 100
And I have really weak arms!
I have a tendancy to cross over but actively concentrate on not doing that, that and high elbow catch.
Should I just not kick and not worry about it?!
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Tupperware
Joined: 09 Oct 2012
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Location: Swindon
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| Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 11:53 am Post subject: |
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| gruffT wrote: | OK, I'll bite.
Regular 85% effort free = 1'55" /100
Similar effort Pull = 1'48" / 100
And I have really weak arms!
I have a tendancy to cross over but actively concentrate on not doing that, that and high elbow catch.
Should I just not kick and not worry about it?! |
Same for me, less effort and more speed with a pull buoy. Because of this I am definitely in the "use a pull buoy way too much" camp. I rationalised/justified this with myself becuase I barely kick when in a wetsuit and most of my races are OW. I assume sorting out the problems in my stroke would result in a faster swim time....but I have tried all sorts of drills a which haven't helped so guess I need some professional critique!
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Jorgan
Joined: 12 Nov 2007
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Location: alles was ich bin, alles was ich war
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| Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 1:04 pm Post subject: |
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| gruffT wrote: | OK, I'll bite.
Regular 85% effort free = 1'55" /100
Similar effort Pull = 1'48" / 100
And I have really weak arms!
I have a tendancy to cross over but actively concentrate on not doing that, that and high elbow catch.
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On entry or during the pull? Again, could be a rotation issue if it's the pull i.e. over-rotating in order to breathe (because you're turning your head skywards when you breathe).
In order to make a High-Elbow catch & EVF easier, you need to swim with 'wide tracks' i.e. hand entry shoulder width apart.
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stenard
Joined: 04 Sep 2013
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| Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 1:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Jorgan wrote: | | gruffT wrote: | OK, I'll bite.
Regular 85% effort free = 1'55" /100
Similar effort Pull = 1'48" / 100
And I have really weak arms!
I have a tendancy to cross over but actively concentrate on not doing that, that and high elbow catch.
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On entry or during the pull? Again, could be a rotation issue if it's the pull i.e. over-rotating in order to breathe (because you're turning your head skywards when you breathe).
In order to make a High-Elbow catch & EVF easier, you need to swim with 'wide tracks' i.e. hand entry shoulder width apart. |
It's little things like this that for me make the weekly club swim session invaluable. Wednesday was a tough session fitness wise, but one of the only direct comments the coach gave to me mid-session was to get my hand entry a little bit wider. On doing so in the next rep, it felt like I was then really wide but could see I was actually now about right, which showed I had over-narrowed without realising.
Having a third party regularly seeing your stroke and picking little things like this up is really helpful
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