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Poet
Joined: 13 Apr 2007
Posts: 10148
Location: Your Mum
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 Posted: Sat Apr 06, 2019 7:02 am Post subject: |
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What the f**k are you lot doing in transition?
Just looked at my results - T1 1:30 T2 0:45 for a “half” and double that for a full.
I’ve never done a 70.3/113.
Bala, Beaver, Beaulieu, Vit all quite short bikes.
Bala was uphill, then down, then turn around and come back.
Great course.
Beaver has the worst swim (you can’t see your hand)
My chain snapped on the bike. Ran a 1:24 (not too short, maybe 400m?) after soft pedalling the bike after repair.
Beaulieu was my first.
Vit was more focussed, but an 85km bike (about +9 minutes at the speeds below)
2009: 0:33/0:02/2:21/0:01/1:30 = 4:27
2010: 0:32/0:02/2:19/0:01/1:30 = 4:24
Doing a <4:30 with a swim over 30 minutes isn’t great,
as you miss the bike packs. You really need to get under 30mins
to cycle in a pack, as it’ll put you in a better place for the run.
Walk the swim exit to YOUR bike spot. Multiple times.
Look for a landmark, when your eyes are hazy post swim.
On race day, it’ll be easy.
Visualise putting your helmet on fast.
Wear your number under your wetsuit.
Walk the bike spot to bike out. Multiple times.
Visualise Race morning.
Walk bike in to bike spot.
Walk bike spot to run out.
Time spent in transition is lost time.
A well fitting wetsuit practically pops itself off.
(My B70 helix certainly did)
You only need to put a helmet on.
Coming back in - helmet off. Running shoes on and away.
Elastic laces and you’re done.
You mention running your HM pace of 1:27 after a “hard” ride might be tricky...the ride should not be hard!!!
About 80% FTP should do it
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Tupperware
Joined: 09 Oct 2012
Posts: 80
Location: Swindon
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| Posted: Sat Apr 06, 2019 11:51 am Post subject: |
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| Poet wrote: | | What the f**k are you lot doing in transition? |
Haha...nice picnic and a cup of tea 
Fastest transition for that race was 1:27 for T1 (overall winner) and 52s for T2 (6th overall), but a good proportion over 2mins in both. Not sure where I burn time, taking it easy into/out of transition or the actual transition itself. Always feels quite frantic despite what the time suggests  .
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jibberjim
Joined: 15 Aug 2008
Posts: 8392
Location: Kingston
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| Posted: Sat Apr 06, 2019 12:15 pm Post subject: |
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| Jorgan wrote: | | Biking gains can improve your run split, but not the other way around.... |
Well it can, but I know what you mean.
However if you're running a 4 hour IM marathon, and improve your run such that a 3 hour IM marathon is on, you've immediately swapped (say) a planned 12 hours for 11 hours, which means you've also got a small increase in intensity you can do on the bike irrespective of fitness. Of course it's not actually likely all that relevant a difference.
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stenard
Joined: 04 Sep 2013
Posts: 2063
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| Posted: Sat Apr 06, 2019 1:01 pm Post subject: |
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Poet - if you've never done a 70.3 or Ironman, then you don't know the complications of their approach to transition. Not having anything by your bike and having to pack up wetsuits, takes a bit (not a lot, but a bit) more time
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Jorgan
Joined: 12 Nov 2007
Posts: 18226
Location: alles was ich bin, alles was ich war
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| Posted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 10:20 am Post subject: |
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| stenard wrote: | | Poet - if you've never done a 70.3 or Ironman, then you don't know the complications of their approach to transition. Not having anything by your bike and having to pack up wetsuits, takes a bit (not a lot, but a bit) more time |
This. Even the Outlaw which Poet has done, has a pretty small transition area compared to most Ironman & 70.3 events. Roth is the only big event I've done where Transitions are pretty short, because of the way they're designed, and there is a 'hand-off' for bikes at T2 and a helper who's already got your T2 bag as your number was radioed ahead!
Most Ironmans & big 70.3s involve running around racking for 3k bikes before you get to the tent to search for your bag.
You should ENTER HAMBURG POET - see what it's all about.
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stenard
Joined: 04 Sep 2013
Posts: 2063
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| Posted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 10:38 am Post subject: |
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| Jorgan wrote: | | stenard wrote: | | Poet - if you've never done a 70.3 or Ironman, then you don't know the complications of their approach to transition. Not having anything by your bike and having to pack up wetsuits, takes a bit (not a lot, but a bit) more time |
This. Even the Outlaw which Poet has done, has a pretty small transition area compared to most Ironman & 70.3 events. Roth is the only big event I've done where Transitions are pretty short, because of the way they're designed, and there is a 'hand-off' for bikes at T2 and a helper who's already got your T2 bag as your number was radioed ahead!
Most Ironmans & big 70.3s involve running around racking for 3k bikes before you get to the tent to search for your bag.
You should ENTER HAMBURG POET - see what it's all about. |
Precisely. As an example for you Poet, my official Mallorca 70.3 transition time was 4:03. The Garmin had it at just under 600m total of additional distance. Even at 80min HM pace that you just ran, that would be 2:15 in terms of time, simply just running the distance. And you're never going to run that fast immediately out of the water! Then you have to find your bag, strip bottom half of wetsuit off, get helmet and everything else out of your bag and wetsuit back in, rehang your bag, and then head off to your bike amongst more than three thousand.
I was pretty pleased with 4 minutes for all of that. T2 was the same in reverse, just a bit quicker as you don't have a wetsuit to strip off and pack.
https://www.strava.com/activities/1566957388
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Poet
Joined: 13 Apr 2007
Posts: 10148
Location: Your Mum
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| Posted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 12:58 pm Post subject: |
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Yeah, alright!
Sounds a bit bad to me - I'll stick with UK races...
...at least for the next three years 
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Jorgan
Joined: 12 Nov 2007
Posts: 18226
Location: alles was ich bin, alles was ich war
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| Posted: Mon Apr 08, 2019 4:03 pm Post subject: |
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| Poet wrote: | Yeah, alright!
Sounds a bit bad to me - I'll stick with UK races...
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The Earth is flat I tell ye!
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crumpy
Joined: 02 Jan 2011
Posts: 502
Location: Worcester
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| Posted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 8:33 pm Post subject: |
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| Poet wrote: |
Doing a <4:30 with a swim over 30 minutes isn’t great,
as you miss the bike packs. You really need to get under 30mins
to cycle in a pack, as it’ll put you in a better place for the run.
You mention running your HM pace of 1:27 after a “hard” ride might be tricky...the ride should not be hard!!!
About 80% FTP should do it |
Agree on trying to hit <30 mins on the swim. If you do, you will be close to a lot of the top rider splits.
I never used to do much swimming - i.e. ramp it up in the last few weeks. By changing and doing 3 sessions a week (and dropping a bike and run session), it helped get me easily under 30 mins without impacting the bike.
This normally (only done a few 70.3) means I end up with a bike IF of 0.85 (ish) as the leaders give me a kick up the ass to be in their vicinity (except the uber bikers). This gives you a 2.20-2.25 bike (assuming it is not silly hilly) and a chance of sub 4.30.
From my experience, the run is then just about how much you can suffer. 5k will go easily enough. Last 16k may not 
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Time to return to Olympic and 70.3
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Poet
Joined: 13 Apr 2007
Posts: 10148
Location: Your Mum
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| Posted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:24 am Post subject: |
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Thinking I might give this a go for the 113...
My swim will be 32-ish.
Bike should be 2:27-2:35, if the roads and course are anything like what I have tested on near me.
That just leaves me 80 minutes for the run 
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Jorgan
Joined: 12 Nov 2007
Posts: 18226
Location: alles was ich bin, alles was ich war
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| Posted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:47 am Post subject: |
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| Poet wrote: | Thinking I might give this a go for the 113...
My swim will be 32-ish.
Bike should be 2:27-2:35, if the roads and course are anything like what I have tested on near me.
That just leaves me 80 minutes for the run |
It's a very flat course, apart from that short hill. But the road surface is almost universally poor; it can also be quite breezy, although early in the morning that's less of a factor.
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Poet
Joined: 13 Apr 2007
Posts: 10148
Location: Your Mum
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| Posted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:57 am Post subject: |
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Do you have a link to the GPX version, or what you have rode there, for it, please?
I think (from the description given), what I rode the other week was very similar.
3W/kg = 35kmh, 83% FTP.
Just looking to see if that was similar to anyone else who has done this course?
I found it hard to run after that, but that was only my third brick in 5 years, more than over-biking. Adding in some more bricks and running now.
Swimming is just about ticking over, with a few sparse speed sessions.
I'm pleased with where my cycling is, as it's roughly the same as what it was previously.
So, just the running endurance/brick to add back into the mix.
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Jorgan
Joined: 12 Nov 2007
Posts: 18226
Location: alles was ich bin, alles was ich war
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Poet
Joined: 13 Apr 2007
Posts: 10148
Location: Your Mum
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| Posted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 11:20 am Post subject: |
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bloody hell!!! That is pancake flat
The hill is 700m in length, rising 40m, so nothing too onerous.
Also, is it 88.6km?
Or, is there a little squiggly bit to do when you come back?
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Buzz_
Joined: 19 May 2007
Posts: 453
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| Posted: Mon Apr 29, 2019 11:23 am Post subject: |
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https://www.strava.com/segments/12345673?filter=overall
I rode part of it yesterday, and had to come off the tri bars on a flat, straight section to avoid being thrown off. Even the resurfaced roads are rough as.
You ride along segments called "Sh#ty road and potholes" among others.
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